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Old 06-01-2009, 07:47 PM   #1
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Default Reputable Breeders Stiffled

I see people always asking why the reputable breeders never come here anymore well I hope I do not offend anyone but let me give my opinion as to why this is the case....A thread was closed because some people disagreed with what a few reputable breeders opinions were and stated. How can us reputable breeders continue to help educate when we can't voice "OUR" opinion on certain subjects or how to help educate others in certain areas. Just because we disagree with certain practices we are stiffled as in the thread being closed due to some getting offended. I personally don't get offended when someone doesn't agree with me. I just state my opinion and move on. So, you see why most reputable "show breeders" have stopped coming and posting. I see it as a lose and a help to many.
Just stating an opinion

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Old 06-01-2009, 07:54 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklynn View Post
I see people always asking why the reputable breeders never come here anymore well I hope I do not offend anyone but let me give my opinion as to why this is the case....A thread was closed because some people disagreed with what a few reputable breeders opinions were and stated. How can us reputable breeders continue to help educate when we can't voice "OUR" opinion on certain subjects or how to help educate others in certain areas. Just because we disagree with certain practices we are stiffled as in the thread being closed due to some getting offended. I personally don't get offended when someone doesn't agree with me. I just state my opinion and move on. So, you see why most reputable "show breeders" have stopped coming and posting. I see it as a lose and a help to many.
Just stating an opinion

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I totally agree with you Donna. And I read the thread you speaking too. Just because someone doesn't approve with pups being sold on this forum I don't think the thread should have been closed. I belong to another forum that does not allow puppies being sold. I visit that forum often and it's very educational and helpful. I don't come to this forum to sell puppies, I come to this forum for the love of the yorkie. Hopefully to reach someone that is comtemplating breeding and hope that I can help them do it the best way possible for the good of the breed.
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Old 06-01-2009, 07:55 PM   #3
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With all due respect, I think you are missing the point. It's not good form to come onto a board and announce that you don't think it is worthy of your donation. I was also surprised about the vet comments because many people here think the collective YT brain knows a lot more about yorkies than a typical vet does.

I think comments about what constitutes good breeding, what people should look for in dogs, what they should watch out for, all these things are appropriate and in fact are often brought up here.

I belong to some boards where it is not allowed to discuss the rules of the board or moderation decisions, period. Do it once, you get a warning, twice, you are banned. I think the moderators here are exceptionally relaxed.

I really hope that being a "reputable breeder" does not mean that you have to look down on those who know less than you do.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:03 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuickSilver View Post
With all due respect, I think you are missing the point. It's not good form to come onto a board and announce that you don't think it is worthy of your donation. I was also surprised about the vet comments because many people here think the collective YT brain knows a lot more about yorkies than a typical vet does.

I think comments about what constitutes good breeding, what people should look for in dogs, what they should watch out for, all these things are appropriate and in fact are often brought up here.

I belong to some boards where it is not allowed to discuss the rules of the board or moderation decisions, period. Do it once, you get a warning, twice, you are banned. I think the moderators here are exceptionally relaxed.


I really hope that being a "reputable breeder" does not mean that you have to look down on those who know less than you do.

couldn't have said it better myself~!
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:07 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuickSilver View Post
With all due respect, I think you are missing the point. It's not good form to come onto a board and announce that you don't think it is worthy of your donation. I was also surprised about the vet comments because many people here think the collective YT brain knows a lot more about yorkies than a typical vet does.

I think comments about what constitutes good breeding, what people should look for in dogs, what they should watch out for, all these things are appropriate and in fact are often brought up here.

I belong to some boards where it is not allowed to discuss the rules of the board or moderation decisions, period. Do it once, you get a warning, twice, you are banned. I think the moderators here are exceptionally relaxed.

I really hope that being a "reputable breeder" does not mean that you have to look down on those who know less than you do.
That's not what I said looking down upon those who know less than I do...I don't know everything but what I do know and what I've experienced in the breeding and showing of yorkies would be of help BUT because of my experience it's considered to be holier than thou, the YTCA code of ethics states that we should help the newbies and explain why some yorkies should NEVER be bred. We hope you or anyone would want to better the breed and listen to those that do have experience and listen and not get offended. We are here to help and we have to uphold the YTCA code of conduct and code of ethics and if we promote breeding pet quality yorkies then we are not doing what is expected of us as members of the YTCA
.
I won't donate for the promotion of selling of puppies but I might make a donation of selling of products and or of the rescuing and caring of dogs. That is a big difference. I still will advocate contacting your vet or mentor for medical advice before seeking answers on a forum but will ask questions regarding health, sickness after I have sought medical advice from a professional. I have no problem in asking or answering questions from certain experiences I've had regarding health issues but a certified medical adivse should be sought first just as in a human baby! You take your human baby to a baby doctor before getting answers online. Common sense should come into play but again just my opinion and would be discouraged if my opinion were to be stiffled. Please don't take offense because I am a firm believer in that we all are entitled to it.

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Last edited by Brooklynn; 06-01-2009 at 08:09 PM.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:19 PM   #6
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Again, the reason for this thread is because I've heard so many wonder and say they wished more of the reputable breeders would post more and I gave my opinion as to why we don't....we are always told we offend, or are rude or we don't agree with someone else's practices, I refuse to sugar coat my beliefs just because it might offend someone. That's the point of this thread. And we do get stiffled just because we disagree with the majority. Sometimes the truth hurts and trust me the truth has come back to bite me in the butt but I've learned from it and didn't take offense but took a step back and reevaluated things and took a different approach. How many times have I been chasited by my mentor when I did something wrong but it was because it was for my own good and I learned from it. As Lorraine stated if it helps at least one person then I've done my job

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Old 06-01-2009, 08:22 PM   #7
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I do appreciate the exhibitor /breeders that have tried to educate and understand where they feel compelled to leave because of the frustrations here. It's like trying to fight the fight that is not possible to ever win, and ultimately the breed becomes the big loser. For the good of the breed, I do hope those types of breeders will always be here.

Mercury, being a reputable breeder does not mean "you have to look down on those who know less than you do". I believe what some take as arrogance from the reputable breeders, is not that at all, it is more an unwavering code of ethics that doesn't tolerate the lack of ethical breeding.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklynn View Post
That's not what I said looking down upon those who know less than I do...I don't know everything but what I do know and what I've experienced in the breeding and showing of yorkies would be of help BUT because of my experience it's considered to be holier than thou, the YTCA code of ethics states that we should help the newbies and explain why some yorkies should NEVER be bred. We hope you or anyone would want to better the breed and listen to those that do have experience and listen and not get offended. We are here to help and we have to uphold the YTCA code of conduct and code of ethics and if we promote breeding pet quality yorkies then we are not doing what is expected of us as members of the YTCA
.
I won't donate for the promotion of selling of puppies but I might make a donation of selling of products and or of the rescuing and caring of dogs. That is a big difference. I still will advocate contacting your vet or mentor for medical advice before seeking answers on a forum but will ask questions regarding health, sickness after I have sought medical advice from a professional. I have no problem in asking or answering questions from certain experiences I've had regarding health issues but a certified medical adivse should be sought first just as in a human baby! You take your human baby to a baby doctor before getting answers online. Common sense should come into play but again just my opinion and would be discouraged if my opinion were to be stiffled. Please don't take offense because I am a firm believer in that we all are entitled to it.

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Do you really think that's the case? I've seen many, many threads where people tell potential breeders that it takes years of research and mentoring to breed responsibly. I've seen tons of threads here where people are told to take their dog to the vet ASAP. I've also seen many threads where moderators are criticized, or the number of "BYBers" here is bemoaned.

I donated to YT because of all the reasons Wylie's Mom listed in the closed thread. I don't look at the breeding section that much. If you are uncomfortable with pups being sold here, then either don't donate, as you have not, or maybe start a thread suggesting that section be closed. Maybe don't start it as "I'm a reputable breeder and I'm appalled by how dumb you all are, and I won't donate unless that shameful puppies for sale section is closed." But if you have a legitimate concern that can be tactfully addressed, that could be a very worthy topic of discussion.

Also, considering that there is another thread by the same breeder that has 5+ pages, I don't think she's being stiffled. Whether or not that was the intention, the closed thread came off as snooty and judgmental. To be honest, I don't think it helps the reputable breeders' cause when people identifying themselves manage to come off as both rude AND overly sensitive.

As for whether there are people here without much common sense - well, it is the internet!
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jencar98 View Post
I do appreciate the exhibitor /breeders that have tried to educate and understand where they feel compelled to leave because of the frustrations here. It's like trying to fight the fight that is not possible to ever win, and ultimately the breed becomes the big loser. For the good of the breed, I do hope those types of breeders will always be here.

Mercury, being a reputable breeder does not mean "you have to look down on those who know less than you do". I believe what some take as arrogance from the reputable breeders, is not that at all, it is more an unwavering code of ethics that doesn't tolerate the lack of ethical breeding.
THANK YOU! I truely appreciate this comment

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Old 06-01-2009, 08:28 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jencar98 View Post
I do appreciate the exhibitor /breeders that have tried to educate and understand where they feel compelled to leave because of the frustrations here. It's like trying to fight the fight that is not possible to ever win, and ultimately the breed becomes the big loser. For the good of the breed, I do hope those types of breeders will always be here.

Mercury, being a reputable breeder does not mean "you have to look down on those who know less than you do". I believe what some take as arrogance from the reputable breeders, is not that at all, it is more an unwavering code of ethics that doesn't tolerate the lack of ethical breeding.
But, in posts such as this (not yours), it is almost always stated that reputable breeder/exhibitors have a Holier Than Thou attitude and look down at others. It makes us feel that we are looked down upon and as Donna stated we become reluctant to post anymore.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:29 PM   #11
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i don't think these breeders are coming off as rude or snooty at all. They are a great source of information on YT. They tell it as it is. Its very sad that many are no longer on YT anymore.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:29 PM   #12
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Default wow

it wasn't too surprising that thread was closed. did you really really think it was THAT surprising.
and honestly, it wouldn't be too surprising if this thread is closed as well.

it's not that good breeders are stifled.
actually i think the title of your thread is rude and accusatory.

i have no problem with what you are saying, but with a title like that, it's not right IMO.

i have never had a problem with people saying what they think. and yes, i would love it if more knowledgeable people stuck around. but perhaps sometimes people need to think about the way they communicate and think about what they are really trying to accomplish.

a lot of times a post things and had to rephrase what i am trying to say because i don't want the person to be offended and stop listening, so i rephrase it as to not turn that person off, and hope that person will be willing to listen and do what's best.

what good does it do to have very knowledgeable people on this site who are condescending and can't get their message across to people? what good does it do to simply say, i don't answer their question because i don't agree with what they are doing? uh...IMO the dogs always end up paying the price if they have a stupid owner and people too selfish or for whatever reason refuse to share their knowledge.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:31 PM   #13
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[, I don't think it helps the reputable breeders' cause when people identifying themselves manage to come off as both rude AND overly sensitive.

I don't see it as being sensitive I see it as "PASSION" for the breed. How many times has it been posted that I want to breed my yorkie one time when it's a pet and no health testing is done and some just can't understand why we won't sell with full breeding rights and get called all sorts of nasty things? I call it upholding the YTCA code of ethics and code of conduct. And you are entitled to your opinion and I appreciate your opinion it's just one I happen not to agree with which is ok with me and I would hope you would appriecate our differences
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:32 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yorkiepuppie View Post
it wasn't too surprising that thread was closed. did you really really think it was THAT surprising.
and honestly, it wouldn't be too surprising if this thread is closed as well.

it's not that good breeders are stifled.
actually i think the title of your thread is rude and accusatory.

i have no problem with what you are saying, but with a title like that, it's not right IMO.

i have never had a problem with people saying what they think. and yes, i would love it if more knowledgeable people stuck around. but perhaps sometimes people need to think about the way they communicate and think about what they are really trying to accomplish.

a lot of times a post things and had to rephrase what i am trying to say because i don't want the person to be offended and stop listening, so i rephrase it as to not turn that person off, and hope that person will be willing to listen and do what's best.

what good does it do to have very knowledgeable people on this site who are condescending and can't get their message across to people? what good does it do to simply say, i don't answer their question because i don't agree with what they are doing? uh...IMO the dogs always end up paying the price if they have a stupid owner and people too selfish or for whatever reason refuse to share their knowledge.
I agree with your post.
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Old 06-01-2009, 08:36 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yorkiepuppie View Post
it wasn't too surprising that thread was closed. did you really really think it was THAT surprising.
and honestly, it wouldn't be too surprising if this thread is closed as well.

it's not that good breeders are stifled.
actually i think the title of your thread is rude and accusatory.

i have no problem with what you are saying, but with a title like that, it's not right IMO.

i have never had a problem with people saying what they think. and yes, i would love it if more knowledgeable people stuck around. but perhaps sometimes people need to think about the way they communicate and think about what they are really trying to accomplish.

a lot of times a post things and had to rephrase what i am trying to say because i don't want the person to be offended and stop listening, so i rephrase it as to not turn that person off, and hope that person will be willing to listen and do what's best.

what good does it do to have very knowledgeable people on this site who are condescending and can't get their message across to people? what good does it do to simply say, i don't answer their question because i don't agree with what they are doing? uh...IMO the dogs always end up paying the price if they have a stupid owner and people too selfish or for whatever reason refuse to share their knowledge.
It only got closed when those disagreed with it, I and a few others are in the minority as to how we feel unfortuantley and no I wasn't surprised "unfortunatley". I don't feel I am being condescending when my passion is so great. What I see in the sick and health section proves my point in what we are trying to convey and educate on. I don't think I've been rude in anyway and in fact been pretty much politically correct in my answers. When we share our knowledge sometimes it's just not what the person wants to hear that is the sad part

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